New Zealand’s infrastructure commission added up every sector’s project wish‑list—and found a bill voters could never realistically pay. In this conversation, Geoff Cooper and Chuck Marohn unpack the national plan that starts by centering maintenance and renewals, then shows how that shifts the debate over big new projects, growth on the fringe, and the pressure on public budgets.Additional Show NotesGeoff Cooper (LinkedIn)Te Waihanga (Site)Te Waihanga National Infrastructure Plan (Site)Chuck Marohn (Substack) This podcast is made possible by Strong Towns members. Thank you!