In this episode of Intelligence Matters, host Michael Morell speaks with former CIA operations officer Jim Lawler about his years of work on counterproliferation matters and his post-CIA pursuit of writing fictional novels, including “Living Lies: A Novel of the Iranian Nuclear Weapons Program.” Lawler and Morell discuss the similarities between recruiting spies and developing literary plots, as well as why a keen sense of empathy is necessary to be accomplished in each. Lawler tells Morell why he believes the most successful operations officers may have a particular neurological capability for convincing spies to steal secrets, which he calls the “metaphysics of recruitment.”  
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"Best Of" Intelligence Matters: Gayle Tzemach Lemmon

Former acting Director of the CIA Michael Morell speaks with top leaders of the U.S. intelligence community as they reflect on their life, career and the critical roles they play in shaping national security policies. As a central figure in the most significant U.S. counter-terror efforts of the past two decades and a former CIA intelligence analyst, Morell is uniquely skilled at taking industry leading knowledge to make connections that provide deep insight into complex security events – helping decode intelligence officials’ key priorities and providing perspectives on how to achieve national security objectives. Morell is the author of “The Great War of Our Time” and a vivid account of the Central Intelligence Agency, a life in secrets, and a war in the shadows.